Born in 1971 in Columbia, SC, Hayess mother was a corrections officer and father a military barber. I think I read somewhere that you only took one creative writing course. in their lockers & hustle to the windows to stare. American Sonnet for My Past and Future Assassin ["Probably twilight makes blackness dangerous"] By Terrance Hayes. His claim of self-defense was rejected by a jury that convicted him, 10-2, of attempted murder, assault and unlawful use of a. I have to fight in ways that a normal American doesnt have to, he said. Another one of my English teachers had gone to Pitt in the sixties, and he talked to Toi Derricotte, and she talked to me and told me to apply. Sign up for the Books & Fiction newsletter. Allen Grossman said, when people ask, What are your poems about? he says, Poetry, the subject is always poetry. I find that to be very useful as a maker of poems, even though thats frustrating for readers. YouTubes privacy policy is available here and YouTubes terms of service is available here. by. Thats the procedural crazy in our law that requires a ruling that says, this opinion is retroactive, Kaplan said. TH: The most basic one is Hegel and the dialectic. Hayess talkative poems are, in fact, a form of thinking, fuelled by opposing impulses and contradictory ideas. Hendrix, his blues pedigree whitewashed by hippie culture, is a powerful figure of passionate ambivalence, unsure how to dance in a way that is both black and not black. But I dont think thats always true for other people. For my poetry, I havent had the prize that makes me feel like Im secure and dont need to write another good poem. You work on the poem, you bring it in, and people say this is wrong, heres a strategy on how to fix it. Terrance Hayes is the author of Wind in a Box (Penguin 2006), Hip Logic (Penguin 2002) and Muscular Music (Carnegie Mellon University Contemporary Classics, 2005 and Tia Chucha Press, 1999). Or in a poem Ill talk about Ol Dirty Bastard and Othello. Could you get a job for a company using your skills with language? Terrence Hayes (center), 37, is shown with his family in their Northeast Portland home on Friday, March 5, 2021. Something happened. In fact, I tried to do that, all the contemporary poetry books and the books on the Pitt Press, because I assumed that everybody else had. Certainly, after enough books and enough acknowledgments, are you still comfortable with failing? Being a slave embodies a stasis that would not sanction the 'mystic bounce' of social refinement. He has to fight his conviction if not for himself, but for a shot at a normal future with his kids. Thats what the academy is: knowing how to find things you dont know, as opposed to these are the things you should know. And to me, academic discourse is about making connections and contextualizing. TH: I dont know how negative that is. It gives me a way to not be limited. Jackson said he was immediately upset when he learned of Rosenblums objection to allowing Ramos type cases to be retried, especially her statement on the potential impacts on the states legal system. I dont necessarily think Im entitled to anything or that I can control very much. I know you paint and have for a long time. I want us to enjoy a meal together, and I cant say its only for me, even though there is a part of meand this is what I like about Ashberythat says, if you dont like it, thats your problem. I like a little sea bass, too, or a little halibut. I had another poem about my father working in the yard called The Earth God, and I worked on it for about two years. He was a Yankee and he was generally bored and impatient with everything about the South, but he liked me and he thought I was special. So I just accepted that. Depending on what space Im in, depending on what kind of water Im in, people see me in very different ways. JW: You have a significant position nowyou won the National Book Award in 2010, and youve won several other awards, and you got the MacArthur in 2014. On the first morning of school there is a young tree- Anybody who has sat down, as I have, to make a list of things that at any given moment could kill him knows that the possibilities are potentially endless, the anxiety correspondingly boundless. I havent seen that prize. And yet I still feel like theres something wrong with trying to force me to support the troops., Ive always had a sense of moving into spaces where I felt a little bit different. For decades, Oregon and Louisiana were the only states that allowed felony convictions by split jury votes. I feel like this is true in the poetry process. This grim audit is amusing to figure out: the Z is hidden in disease; the only X I can locate is in the word exist. Hayes nods to Gwendolyn Brookss poem The Mother, about abortion, and invokes Robert Lowell, the Mayflower maniac, whose unrhymed sonnets are a shadow text for this book. How do you see that affecting creative writing programs? Theres some moments in David Foster Wallaces nonfiction, like Consider the Lobster, that do it. JW: I like the essays more than the fiction. Terrance Hayes: I have a line in the last book about how to draw an invisible man, and it says, Im trying to be transparent. I dont actually want to be invisible, which is the dilemma of people of color, but I would like to be transparent, so people can see what my issues are, good and bad. David Remnick talks with Dean Baquet, the executive editor of the Times, and Maggie Haberman, a White House correspondent for the paper, about reporting on Trump and the perils facing American democracy. The thing that limits people sometimes is that, at a certain age, they start to say, This is what I do.. But I have no nose, no mouth, so you tell me what's good, what's god, what's funky. The day after . And I think, if I was really trying to fully capture consciousness, I would have to leave poems. Most black people know thisAbout him. I think for younger people especially, everything is so simultaneous now. He fears a more immediate kind of danger, which cant be aestheticized or glorified in verse. Everybody assumes that the I is a confessional I, and they assume that with me, but I find its a useful device so I can lie to people in plain sight. Hayes said hes fortunate to have been able to get his electricians license in prison, an opportunity afforded to only a handful of people, and he found a job in July. Future has this song Fuck Up Some Commas. Hes talking about money, but when I hear it, I hear it about syntax and the way a sentence is built. JW: I want to come back to how you reflect upon your own success, but first I want to ask about your relation to art. Probably all my encounters. You have the same judge that has the ability to rectify this offense particularly because this law is particularly steeped in racism, Hayes said. Its all these other things and the more, the better. Another U.S. Supreme Court case, however, could address it sooner. She cited the practical consequences of allowing hundreds, potentially thousands of past cases be retried. Americas struggle with itselfHas always had people like me at the heart of it. So when my mother saw my earliest poems in the first book, she was like, Oh, it was just your imagination.. Could you run a press? In other cases, such as Hayes, Rosenblum wouldnt directly determine whether a retrial is warranted, but as the states chief legal officer her decision would set a precedent that others would likely follow. The girls are eager to transform him with a kiss; the boys eager It allows me to not get too caught up in terms of privacy and secrecy across the poems. JW: You do sometimes talk about race and recent politics. Part of my personality, certainly, is because Im black, and Im Southern, and Im male. Im always torn between the dilemma of saying there has to be something worthwhile to someone other than myself, even though I can get pretty far just eating what I make for myself and having no one else at the table. Im not that interested in anything other than making something, playing with something, and it doesnt have to be anything other than poetry. There have always been mediocre poets and a large number doing the same thing. That goes back to transparency. And I think that that - this relentless title comes back to the relentlessness of, you know, the American racism that we live with. Some of the older teachers crowd in the doorway like befuddled geese. In his poems, in which he occasionally invents formal constraints, Hayes considers themes of popular culture, race, music, and masculinity. To stay with the food metaphor, you can make something bad. - abstract. These cases returned to the county level, where district attorneys could decide whether to retry or take some other action. "Hayes's fourth book puts. Im not asking to get rid of Bach and Beethoven and only to listen to this knucklehead from Atlanta. Accuracy and availability may vary. He was emotional not just because of the legal implications for himself, but also the symbolic significance of overturning a law many believe is rooted in systemic racism. Terrance Hayes is probably the most innovative poet addressing the complexities of race in America today. Eat something else. You say it's really inventive. He had been in Vietnam, and I think he worked as one of JFKs speech-writers or something like that, but he had left all of that and had this big horse farm in Camden. So I operate in the long view: whatever prize I get today doesnt guarantee a real legacy. Because I wasnt in a class and didnt have to turn it in at the end of the week and revise it and turn it in again in a portfolio at the end of the semester, I could just work. Youre a synthetic poet. The joke in my classes and in my household is that I am always timing and measuring everything. TH: Yesand many other things. This is one of the deepest accounts I have read in poetry of what it feels like to have ones body fetishized as an object but criminalized as a force. Its not like the basketball team. We will take a very serious look at whether the interests of justice are served in retrying Ramos cases that are returned to us after a court ruling, and we plan to center equity and fairness in making these determinations, Weisberg said. Race might be part of my identity, but its not the only thing thats there. I thought, Wow, a poem a week? Even now, I really dont show people stuff when Im working on it. In those nonfiction pieces, hes totally present, and Im totally with him; Im totally in his head. Its a pecha kucha, a Japanese form. Hes still on post-prison supervision. JW: If I were to periodize your work, Id say there are three phases so far. And if jurors of color dissent from the majority, their votes effectively dont count, critics say. Ive realized that my students definitely need to be praised and encouraged, but my method goes back, again, to the way I write my own poems. How can I be a better teacher? So maybe thats a form of ambivalence. SHAPIRO: Tess Taylor sharing Terrance Hayes's new collection called "American Sonnets From My Past And Future Assassin." TH: You get that with students. What I would say to him is that I was just trying to build up a surface. His own attempt to cook for the first time again hes embarrassed to say resulted in a burnt grilled cheese sandwich. Maybe its generational, too. Probably someone is prey in all of our encounters. You've got the soundtrack. Since this means there will be no classes for the rest of the day, the children dump their school gear in their lockers & hustle to the windows to stare. Could you do community workshops? But his felony excludes him from better-paying federal contracts, he said. So an experimental workshop asks, Why were you trying to do this? Im not sure how to hold my face when I dance, he writes: In an expression of determination or euphoria?. And the poem opens out into this big question - define life. Tess, thanks so much. Terrance Hayes is a poet who reflects on race, gender, and family in works marked by formal dexterity and a reverence for history and the artistry of crafting verse. Terrance Hayes began writing this innovative "crown" (or "corona") of sonnets the day after Donald Trump was elected US president, and Trump himself is clearly among the company addressed . And yet: You would be more beautiful without your fear.. JW: Do you consider yourself an African-American poet? The conviction obstructs him in other ways. What does it mean to say only certain people? TH: Gentle Measures almost went into Lighthead, but I just didnt have it finished. Which is to say, A nigga can survive. It directly asks the high court whether the Ramos case applies retroactively; a ruling is expected by July. I learned this stuff in college, and it has become one way for me to understand what metaphor is. TH: Thats a great question. You were outside the main academic pipeline and didnt have a silver spoon. Multnomah County District Attorney Mike Schmidt doesnt have the same discretion as Williams. Eliot, so the model for the poet who lives as a poet would primarily be rich white dudes. Some of the resources available to me now allow me to put myself in new situations, but that has never been my ambition. frog waiting patiently at the front gate. For the known cases though, Rosenblum can ask the court to reverse the convictions and send them back to county district attorneys for retrial. Activists want Rosenblum to act now, otherwise an answer could be months away. The issue of retroactivity is a legal doctrine that was specifically not decided by the Ramos decision, said Rosenblum spokesperson Kristina Edmunson. Born in Columbia, South Carolina, Terrance Hayes earned a BA at Coker College and an MFA at the University of Pittsburgh. We knew where it came from, we knew it was designed culturally for us, for Black men, people of color, Jackson said. Im not saying its confessional, but it gives more texture to your work if you can figure out how not to close off those rooms. Its the right thing to do; we shouldnt wait for a court ruling to do this, association legislative director Mae Lee Browning told The Oregonian/OregonLive. But Im still trying to get people to the table. I also was in track and field. Maybe the one thats covered up is more interesting, and maybe the last result is sort of a failure, but thats all right, Im still going through the process. the afternoon came evening's bell. Since graduate school, Hayes has published a steady stream of books, beginning with Muscular Music (Tia Chucha Press, 1999; reprint Carnegie Mellon University Press, 2006); Hip Logic (Penguin, 2002), selected for the National Poetry Series; Wind in a Box (Penguin, 2006); Lighthead (Penguin, 2010), which won a National Book Award; How to Draw (Penguin, 2015); and the forthcoming American Sonnets for My Past and Future Assassin (Penguin, 2018). They love their grandpop, Jackson said. The authoritative record of NPRs programming is the audio record. TAYLOR: Yeah, that raise questions. The names alive are like the names, In graves. My interest is not what people expect from me as a poet; I know I can make burgers, but can I make sushi? Tacuma Jackson was 26 when he was involved in a tavern heist in 2000. It seems more ambivalent, too. Everybody has their own weird thing, and mine is that I like books. And his answer is its just language, its just poetry. Ad Choices. Those arent academic poems. TH: The thing that I appreciate with an undergrad is the freedom of writing and not connecting that to professional aspirations. They hope to provide resources for mental health, substance abuse, domestic violence and re-entry for formerly incarcerated people. Ive always tried to stay very focused in terms of what I need to write. You've got the music. My father would say, Youre going to go to collegeyoure smart. But they didnt have any savings. Im not doing enough as an individual if Im not seeking out new experiences, new people, being challenged, being honest with who I am, or my poems are going to be stuck. In the second and third books, Hip Logic and Wind in a Box, youre experimenting more with form, whether it be the sonnet or other patterns of repetition. I smile at Ronald's poster, perpetual grin behind the pissed-off, fly-girl cashier I love. He attended Coker College on a basketball scholarship, but explored painting and poetry and, encouraged by an English professor there and the poet Toi Derricotte, went to the University of Pittsburgh for an MFA in Creative Writing. Oregon Attorney General Ellen Rosenblum has the power to allow post-conviction relief cases be sent back to county district attorneys for retrial. If I dont do something about this, then they still have to deal with all the stigmas that come with a father with a violent history, he said. She could choose to let those peoples cases through and let them start over and get a fair trial, Kaplan said. Terrance Hayes, Hip Logic, Penguin Books, 2002. Theres an assumption in contemporary literature that writers represent their identities. When he left the Oregon State Penitentiary two decades later, he had grandchildren. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information. Students should be able to bring us the now, and we should be able to bring them the research and the history, and then that middle ground is what the academy is. Its okay if I spent all that time on this manuscript, and it is, by some terms, a failure, but by other terms, its going to lead to something at some point. In January, Jackson was granted early release by Gov. Its still an open-ended process. Maybe I can, but I need to try that. As a student of poetry, I find that confessionalism is a great tool that fiction writers dont have. If youre just trying to make art, nobody has to buy what you do, and the world doesnt need it, so I try to tell them to relax. Many landlords wouldnt rent to him as an ex-felon. That figure is just moving around. He is known for his collections American Sonnets for My Past and Future Assassins and To Float In The Space Between. I was excited for folks, but I understood there was gonna be people like me who would ask for relief and have to fight to get it, Hayes said. For this latest collection, he made one big choice at the outset: all the sonnets share the same title, American Sonnet for My Past and Future Assassin. This repetition is superstitious, a tribute paid to the imagined assassin, as if the poems can buy back time in fourteen-line reprieves. It's like he's made these sonnets to try to contain something uncontainable. Trumpet reinforces. I can put things together and see what is made without having to choose. Terrence Haynes. [7], In 2018, Hayes premiered Cycles of My Being commissioned by Opera Philadelphia, Lyric Opera of Chicago, and Carnegie Hall with music by Tyshawn Sorey starring Lawrence Brownlee. [3] He received a B.A. On May 27, 1999, 22-year-old Terrence Haynes was standing on the porch of a friend, Gary Hammond Jr., in Kankakee, Illinois, when 18-year-old Cezaire Murrell walked up the sidewalk, shoved a man out of the way, and came onto the porch to confront Haynes. So I would hope that in my forties I would be different, more interesting, and know moreand probably be more ambivalentthan I was in my twenties. He envies poets who have the luxury of wandering into all corners of American life. As of late January, 201 people with public defenders in Oregon had filed for post-conviction relief, and 50 of them are in Multnomah County, according to data gathered by the Criminal Justice Reform Clinic. I need the tension of asking myself day to day, Is that what I think? Maybe thats what gets called ambivalence or curiosity or even just playingand it was different when I was in my twenties. Define life. People can come and sit around and talk about work. But if I dont know that, then the poem will also be about that; it will be about not knowing. Thats a better way of being an artist to me; thats a more interesting artist who doesnt know and is pursuing an answer versus an artist who does know. I think theres a good book-length poem in here. But I still couldnt do it. Terrence L. Hayes, press secretary, Office of Public and Intergovernmental Affairs: Prior to assuming the role of VA press secretary, Terrence Hayes served as national director of Communication and Public Affairs for the Veterans of Foreign Wars. He attended Coker College on a basketball scholarship, but explored painting and poetry and, encouraged by an English professor there and the poet Toi Derricotte, went to the University of Pittsburgh for an MFA in Creative Writing. Some of them want that, but they dont know what it looks like or know enough about the template for becoming a successful writer, so they wind up writing really interesting things all the time. I was just doing a Q and A and bouncing between The Simpsons and Picasso. Movies. So, if Im talking to someone, and I mention Glenn Gould and Future, or Picasso and Lil Wayne, my mind is always bridging those two things. I mean, he could've just given the book that title and called each sonnet one, two, three, four, five or the first line of the poem. How you get fairly boring poems about race is because you are trying to plug into some notion about identity, as opposed to some notion of personality. I like the poem where you play off the line Thank you for your service.. Whats going to be left out? Dont you want to see me eat it too? I dont know how many people know this, but I was on ESPN for the National Scholastic Indoor Track and Field Championships. Hes signing up for online courses in communications and marketing to help with a foundation co-founded by his wife, a substance abuse and mental health professional. To go back to your point about the later books, in Lighthead, the first poem begins with a line, I could never get the hang of Time, and the epigraph is a Borges quote from A New Refutation of Time. At some point I realized, even more than fatherhood, even more than parents, even more than race, the thing Im really obsessed with is measuring time. My point about the academic is not about high or low, its just that theres outside information. That might be true, but I think for the last ten or fifteen years, Ashbery wrote the same book. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. My default answer to just about everything in the world is, Man, Im just going to go write a poem. When things get rough, whether its grading student papers or paying the bills or a fight with my wife, my default answer is to write a poem and just forget about all of it. It gets into the art for arts sake versus social purpose argument, but I think the real purpose is who do you want at the table with you? You aint allowed to derideWomen when youve never wept in front of a womanThat wasnt your mother. I thought, maybe Ill teach, and if I didnt teach, maybe Ill go work in the prison. With success, you get encouraged to think, Im so special that people will just watch me be me. So when Pacino starts being himself in his movies and stops acting, people accept that and say, Oh, its Al Pacino! Could you be a high school English teacher? His 2010 collection, Lighthead, won the National Book Award for Poetry in 2010. My grandfather was a war veteran; my dad was in the army; my brother was in the army. And you cant force anybody to accept your art; you cant make people take the food that youre giving them. You write a poem, and you think its a failed poem, but maybe its a draft, and you just keep going onto the next poem. My dad said, Maybe you should major in business. If he had said that when I was eight years old, I probably would have done it, but it was too late. Im a student of poetry, and I feel like everythings on the table, and I can use it all. He is very much interested in what it means to be an artist and a black man. Currently a MacArthur Fellow, Hayes synthesizes disparate elements in his work: classical forms like the sonnet; popular culture references from hip-hop to Scooby-Doo; comments on race, especially African-American experience; modes such as the Japanese business presentation slide series pecha kucha; and reflections on fatherhood and family. How does that bear on your poetry? The New York School poets are interesting to me for their immediacy; New York School culture is about being present and being in the moment. But does that mean Im only making black-eyed peas and collard greens? Are you making a landscape or a figure drawing when you put the puzzle together? Sometimes they seem eclecticwith references from pop culture to high artbut your motivation is toward synthesis. from the University of Pittsburgh writing program. Both of them were in the packet I sent to get into Pitt. JW: Youve had plenty of critics comment on your work, but if you said there was a quality that it has, what would it be? Because Oregon is 76% white and 2% Black, according to U.S. Census figures, critics say its rare to see more than one or two black jurors assigned to any jury. But the big challenge was other people trying to tell me how to fix the poems. I wrote them one at a time, and there are six, because a box has six sides. TAYLOR: And then there's these other moments where it's really unclear who he's talking to. Thats how I work, from one day to the next. But then there are the poems that are just about feelings and about family, and maybe you dont have to have a dictionary or internet next to you. People confuse privacy and secrecy way too much. Photograph by Gabriele Stabile for The New Yorker, The New Yorker Interview with David Remnick, American Sonnets for My Past and Future Assassin. If its unconstitutional, why wouldnt it apply? asked Aliza Kaplan, a Lewis & Clark law professor who directs the Criminal Justice Reform Clinic at the law school and has been a vocal advocate against nonunanimous jury verdicts. Like, one of these sonnets begins, (reading) a remix of "Pony" by Ginuwine plays while half a dozen beautiful black men strut on stage wearing translucent black housecoats, then pause with their backs to us before a slow twerking as half a dozen beautiful black women walk on stage in sharp alabaster tuxedos and surgical masks. JW: When you went to Coker College, you went for visual arts. I think about the next poem, because Im always thinking I could do better, and have I done the best I can? Its the name people of color call/Themselves on weekends & the name colorful/People call their enemies & friends. Or, in the manner of a personals ad, to invite her closer: A brother versed in spiritual calisthenics/And cowboy quiet seeks funny, lonesome,/Speculative or eye-glassed lass. Alongside these gamelike poemsthere is a sonnet about Scrabbleare tributes to Emily Dickinson and Langston Hughes, an appreciation of James Baldwins face, and the first #MeToo-era elegy Ive ever read, working through the legacy of Derek Walcott. His name was Jack French, and he actually called up Maya Angelou for me when he was trying to convince me that I could do this. I was just at one on page 37, and it ends in the middle of an interstate rest stop parking lot. Me, academic discourse is about making connections and contextualizing them were the... Asks the high Court whether the Ramos case applies retroactively ; a ruling that says, this opinion retroactive., otherwise an answer could be months away tribute paid to the table www.npr.org for further information America... 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